2020 Season - UK Episode Discussion

[Red Ranger 1]

I've never quite sure why people who seem to like Dean seem so keen to have a "He's not your son" twist that would result in him being crushed.Do they really dislike Amber that much? Anyway, Willow said what I meant to say last time round: Fair enough, it wasn't Dean's choice not to be around, but Jai's turned out as a happy and well-adjusted child so Amber can't be that bad.

It feels like the Angelo v Colby storyline is just running on the spot now.The episode teased major developments but is ultimately back at square one.Dean and Willow don't have the same automatic support of Thorne that they did when they first started this cover-up, but they're still not ready to blow the whistle, and while things aren't exactly back to normal between them at the end of the episode, Dean seemed to accept Colby's supportive friend behaviour and Willow is back giving him hints.The end, with Thorne trying to dig up dirt on Angelo, is probably going to lead somewhere, but whether it's going to be anywhere interesting...(It'd be nice to get an explanation for how Angelo's back in the police.)

I've been puzzled for weeks so I'll say it: What exactly is Christian's situation? He was a specialist that Tori contacted to help with Justin, yet he's done the operation and he's still hanging around the hospital treating other patients. Has he got a full-time job there now or is he just on attachment until he's finished Justin's post-op care or something? Anyway, I did like all the byplay between Leah, Justin and Tori.I agree that Tori's reading too much into things by calling Jasmine and Christian's dinner a "date" but otherwise I don't think she's done anything wrong.

[Nephlim14]

4 hours ago, Red Ranger 1 said:

I've never quite sure why people who seem to like Dean seem so keen to have a "He's not your son" twist that would result in him being crushed.Do they really dislike Amber that much? Anyway, Willow said what I meant to say last time round: Fair enough, it wasn't Dean's choice not to be around, but Jai's turned out as a happy and well-adjusted child so Amber can't be that bad.

Its not just Amber, its also the circumstances. I wont deny that there arent people who want the twist. Im one of those people, ESPECIALLY now for spoilery reasons. But I started out as suspicious due to the fact that she only decided to bring this up when Dean was about to go search for Bella. Not the moment she found out she was pregnant, not the moment she arrived at the bay.

Then I started rooting for it when it became clear how much of a #BitterBabyMama she would be. Dean had to literally beg her to even see the kid. And even then she didnt even want to introduce them right. Also, theres the overall situation. The way it is now, she has complete control of his access to Jai, and she could cut it off for whatever reason. And between the two of them, shes been the one looking for stuff to complain about.

[H&Alover]

I'm with you Red, why this 'Jai isn't Dean's kid'  theme - we've  had this storyline twice already, let it be third time lucky.  In answer to your question Nephlim, in case you missed it, Amber didn't tell Dean when she found out she was pregnant  because her and Dean had already split and they weren't a proper couple, she said herself Jai was a result of her being a rebound bonk. Not sure Dean would have been ready to be a daddy back then anyway.  Her coming to the bay, seeing Dean and announcing "hello again Dean, how are you, btw you're a dad" would not have been a good way of reuniting.   The reason why she didn't want to introduce Dean to Jai as his dad right away was for a very good reason, Dean may not have connected with Jai or vice versa, it would have saved both of them pain, especially Jai.  She hadn't bad mouthed Dean as Jai was happy to talk about his dad, telling Dean he liked footie. She has had sole care of Jai for five years, her choice, so of course she has a say and he doesn't seem neglected in any way, maybe it's only recently she's got back into the clubbing routine? 

Long story short - sort of - Ben used to make his own boards but wanted to expand so Dean rang an old mate to place a large order to get Ben started and loaned him £20,000 from the £50,000 he got from his dad as hush money to get him started. There is another story involved there, but the upshot is when Ben left he gave Dean the board shop for having faith in him.  So Dean does owe Ben something as Ben had faith in him when no-one else  did.

Yes we all know Colby is as guilty as sin but Angelo really does himself no favours as coming across as so smug, that would get anyone's back up.  I had to admire Dean acting so cool when Angelo was trying to prise some sort of admission Colby was guilty  out of him.  That tilt of the head he gave Colby when he saw him was just arrogant.  

Oh there is dirt on Angelo alright and a reason he left the police..  But was for a good reason.  It happened again another very heated discussion about YKW and YKW with all the doors to the flat open.  All Angelo needs to do is hang around when Willow, Dean and Colby are there and he'd get all he needed. 

Tori does so fancy Christian, despite her protests, and I think it's reciprocated. I believed Jasmine when she said her and Christian  happened to in Salt at the same time and were just having a drink as colleagues.  Tori and Christian did work together very well as a professional team, which brings me to your point Red, why is he still there?    Is it as you suggest to see Justin's through Justin's post op care or has he been taken on full time?  

[Nephlim14]

1 hour ago, H&Alover said:

I'm with you Red, why this 'Jai isn't Dean's kid'  theme - we've  had this storyline twice already, let it be third time lucky.  In answer to your question Nephlim, in case you missed it, Amber didn't tell Dean when she found out she was pregnant  because her and Dean had already split and they weren't a proper couple, she said herself Jai was a result of her being a rebound bonk. Not sure Dean would have been ready to be a daddy back then anyway.  Her coming to the bay, seeing Dean and announcing "hello again Dean, how are you, btw you're a dad" would not have been a good way of reuniting.   The reason why she didn't want to introduce Dean to Jai as his dad right away was for a very good reason, Dean may not have connected with Jai or vice versa, it would have saved both of them pain, especially Jai.  She hadn't bad mouthed Dean as Jai was happy to talk about his dad, telling Dean he liked footie. She has had sole care of Jai for five years, her choice, so of course she has a say and he doesn't seem neglected in any way, maybe it's only recently she's got back into the clubbing routine? 

Not being a couple has never been an excuse. Unless Dean wasnt around, she still should have told him. And how can you be so sure that Dean wouldnt have been a dad? For all her talk, it should be noted that Amber was with the River Boys same as him. I doubt she was some choir girl that got led astray by him.

And, the issue isnt as simple as her having a say. How to put this............................As good as her excuses sound, its pretty obvious that in her eyes, Dean is a nonperson. She wanted to raise Jai on her own and she didnt care who that would end up hurting. Dean is trying to be a father to Jai, but Amber keeps looking for reasons to push him away. Anytime Dean doesnt agree with her on something, she has no problem holding Jai over his head. The problem is that the situation has the potential to be like the movie Alexandra's Project. Amber seems perfectly ready to take Jai and run if theres even the slightest disagreement/issue crops up. And with so many kids growing up fatherless because of deadbeats, it has to be grating when it comes to cases where the mother actively alienates their kids just cuz they dont want to work out whatever issue they have.

Edited November 3, 2020 by Nephlim14

[Red Ranger 1]

Again, a lot of talk about why Amber's a horrible person, but not one reason why Jai would/should not be Dean's son. I guess people don't like Amber so don't want Dean to have a tie to her, but wanting him to lose his son seems rather extreme. (In fact, metaphysically, it seems to make the people lobbying for it as bad as they claim Amber is!) I've not seen one iota of evidence to back up this theory.Whatever faults Amber has, she doesn't tend to lie.And she doesn't seem to be trying to trap Dean (again, complaining about her not telling him sooner or not letting him spend enough time with Jai seems to go against the theory) so why exactly do people keeping coming out with this? I mean, I could very well end up looking like an idiot if it turns out to be true, but much like the "Taylor is an undercover cop" theory, it seems to be an idea that people have got in their heads and refuse to let go of no matter how much evidence they see to the contrary.

And again, the events of today's episode really don't make sense if Jai isn't Dean's son.Dean had good intentions but he really should have read the situation better rather than trying to force money on Amber and alienating her.I doubt he'd appreciate someone doing that to him.Not that I agree with Amber entirely, but she's got her pride, and they could do with some sort of formal arrangement rather than Dean trying to swoop in. Quite a few people got to meet Jai. I'm not sure if we've ever seen Bella with someone younger so that was interesting, and he continues to melt John's gruff exterior.

Thorne is definitely outdoing Angelo in the smug stakes.He continues to have some god complex where he thinks he's above the law, the rules and common decency.Angelo is simply doing his job and trying to solve the murder, but of course Thorne doesn't want that, and he's willing to destroy someone's career rather than give up a life bought with someone else's blood.Taylor needs to take off the blinkers and have a long hard think about why Colby feels the need to "protect my family" from the police.Her comment about Angelo needing to work hard to get back in the police really deserved more elaboration than an offhand back story about him getting the wrong man.I've no idea what Bella's hoping to achieve by confronting Taylor.She's obviously not going to tell her the truth and it's unlikely Taylor will pay attention to a "Stay away from my brother" lecture.Or indeed that she won't tell Colby, who's unlikely to be happy.

So...Christian isn't working at Northern District full time? Justin casually telling Jasmine everything while Leah became more and more exasperated was very funny.And we're back with flustered schoolgirl Tori, which I've kind of got used to after all these years.Jasmine's calm matchmaking again felt like she's back to her old self.

Edited November 4, 2020 by Red Ranger 1

[CaptainHulk]

On 03/11/2020 at 00:25, Red Ranger 1 said:

I've never quite sure why people who seem to like Dean seem so keen to have a "He's not your son" twist that would result in him being crushed.Do they really dislike Amber that much? 

If MJ made bank for writing a song about a kid not being his, there's nothing stopping Dean!

I'll see myself out. Hee hee.

*moonwalks away*

Edited November 4, 2020 by CaptainHulk

[H&Alover]

Amber does have her bad side, clubbing, getting slaughtered, sleeping with random guys and winding people up but she does love Jai and we can see she's done a good job of bringing him up on her own, he's a happy, well cared for boy.  It was a cack handed way with Dean trying to give her that money and from what she said/says she's scared he'll want to take over Jai, when all he wanted to do was to help her get over this cash flow problem she has.  It was a bit awkward and sad when Dean asked Jai what he was getting for his birthday and he looked at Amber and she gave him a look and he said he didn't need anything. She's never hinted that Dean should pay any back maintenance for him, hasn't asked for any money to buy Jai essential items, like shoes, clothes.   It is sweet the way John is with Jai.   The little actor - River Jarvis - who plays Jai is terrific and it looks like he's been given free rein regards his lines.  Both Colby and Bella have now met Jai, though it seemed before Dean wasn't keen on Colby knowing him.  If Amber doesn't get another local patient it would mean her going wherever the next one is.

Going by what Colby found out Angelo's mistake happened after he re-joined the force and was a detective not a uniformed cop like he was when he was last in the bay.   That was one fast track promotion btw, seeing  as it was only nine years ago when he had to leave the force, due to letting Martha and Hugo escape.  I knew there had to be a reason why he is so gung ho on getting his man this time.  All cops make mistakes but it seemed his was a biggie. Thing is with being so tunnel visioned like he is about Colby it can backfire if he hasn't got solid proof and it can seem like it is harassment. How is he so sure Colby is the one? Was it Colby's attitude from the beginning, because if I remember right when Angelo first told Colby and Bella both their reactions seemed totally normal.  His using Taylor the way he did was awful.  No s-ding going on with their hug btw and Bella caught him on a lie again! Had to smile when both Taylor and Dean asked Angelo and Colby respectively "what the hell was going on?"

Only light relief was the Tori/Christian/Jasmine story.  From what I saw it looked like Tori is Christian's boss - he was deferring to her when she was issuing her orders.   She, Tori, was really sniffy with Jasmine and Christian and she left Jasmine totally confused with her "be careful who you trust" talk.  Maybe he shouldn't have but I'm glad Justin blabbed, at least Jasmine wasn't left thinking Tori had changed her mind about the AVO and explained everything.  Jas' matchmaking didn't quite come off the way she planned right away.  Really chuckled when Tori burst through the doors at home ranting on and made the remark about the 'hot doc' only to find him sitting there.   Leah dragging Justin out to feed poor Buddy - who's' been abandoned in the garden again - so Christian and Tori could talk.  Hs admission that the only person he was interested was her was sweet and him saying he called her the 'hot doc' as he left made her day.  

[Nephlim14]

19 hours ago, Red Ranger 1 said:

Again, a lot of talk about why Amber's a horrible person, but not one reason why Jai would/should not be Dean's son. I guess people don't like Amber so don't want Dean to have a tie to her, but wanting him to lose his son seems rather extreme. (In fact, metaphysically, it seems to make the people lobbying for it as bad as they claim Amber is!) I've not seen one iota of evidence to back up this theory.Whatever faults Amber has, she doesn't tend to lie.And she doesn't seem to be trying to trap Dean (again, complaining about her not telling him sooner or not letting him spend enough time with Jai seems to go against the theory) so why exactly do people keeping coming out with this? I mean, I could very well end up looking like an idiot if it turns out to be true, but much like the "Taylor is an undercover cop" theory, it seems to be an idea that people have got in their heads and refuse to let go of no matter how much evidence they see to the contrary.

And again, the events of today's episode really don't make sense if Jai isn't Dean's son.Dean had good intentions but he really should have read the situation better rather than trying to force money on Amber and alienating her.I doubt he'd appreciate someone doing that to him.Not that I agree with Amber entirely, but she's got her pride, and they could do with some sort of formal arrangement rather than Dean trying to swoop in. Quite a few people got to meet Jai. I'm not sure if we've ever seen Bella with someone younger so that was interesting, and he continues to melt John's gruff exterior.

The main reason for the theory is the possibility that not being his son would be easier to recover from than him being his son and then getting cut off from him by Amber

3 hours ago, H&Alover said:

Amber does have her bad side, clubbing, getting slaughtered, sleeping with random guys and winding people up but she does love Jai and we can see she's done a good job of bringing him up on her own, he's a happy, well cared for boy.  It was a cack handed way with Dean trying to give her that money and from what she said/says she's scared he'll want to take over Jai, when all he wanted to do was to help her get over this cash flow problem she has.  It was a bit awkward and sad when Dean asked Jai what he was getting for his birthday and he looked at Amber and she gave him a look and he said he didn't need anything. She's never hinted that Dean should pay any back maintenance for him, hasn't asked for any money to buy Jai essential items, like shoes, clothes.   It is sweet the way John is with Jai.   The little actor - River Jarvis - who plays Jai is terrific and it looks like he's been given free rein regards his lines.  Both Colby and Bella have now met Jai, though it seemed before Dean wasn't keen on Colby knowing him.  If Amber doesn't get another local patient it would mean her going wherever the next one is.

1. I havent heard anyone say Amber is mistreating Jai or is a bad mother. Im saying she's metaphysically using him as either a means of control or an excuse to make an already complicated situation worse than it needs to be. And the issue isnt just the fact that she held out, its the demeanor she's shown ever since as well. She only told Dean under desperation and duress. And anytime they tried to move forward, there was always reluctance on her part.. She constantly gives this demeanor that she should be raising Jai on her own, and wishes Dean had walked away.

2. When it comes to situations like this, I always bring up the question "would the reaction be the same if it was the other way around". Whether Dean was sensitive enough or not is irrelevant because it wasnt a situation that should have been about anyone's pride, insecurities, grudges or whatever other hang up. Dean heard she having money issues and he wanted to help his son and the mother of his son. I dont recall him claiming to want her owing him or something. Like I said before, we know she's been raising Jai longer. She knows that, and Dean knows that. There was no reason for it to go there.

3. I want to say more, but Im commenting as someone who's been on the Australian episode pace. Its probably better to wait untill you guys see later episodes to understand more of what Im trying to say.

[Red Ranger 1]

I think this is going to be a recurring theme, but Colby seems to have lost touch with reality altogether now.Does he think he can sabotage both Angelo's investigation and Angelo's marriage and somehow come out of it with a happy ending? Him asking Bella how she thinks Angelo's going to react to "you messing with his wife" was so utterly absurd that I don't know if he can even hear the words coming out of his mouth.Not that Taylor's any better: She doesn't seem to want to leave Angelo, yet she's still fooling around with Colby.Does she envisage Angelo solving the case and her leaving Colby behind? If so, the penny needs to drop that Angelo doesn't need to fit up an innocent man to get revenge on Colby, he just needs to catch the guilty one.(Does she know Colby is Angelo's chief suspect? He mentioned to her yesterday that he thought Dean knew something, after all.) Sadly, I have to agree with Nikau that Bella's being crazy.It's the effect Colby has on her, and yet more evidence that being with him is, at best, the second worst thing that could have happened to her.

I did wonder briefly if Amber's had some bad experiences in the past.Her chat with Willow didn't seem to change her mind to start with, but she was more willing to compromise when she chatted to Dean the second time.As he says, she chose to tell him he had a son, she must have known that would lead to him wanting to be a father.It did cross my mind that, given John doesn't seem to have any sort of home life since he and Marilyn broke up, if Amber and Jai need somewhere to stay in the Bay, they could do worse than move in with him.

Owen seemed quite depressed here: His mood doesn't really seem to have changed at all since the birthday, and maybe he needs to get away from Evan's "ghost" for a bit.Roo suddenly talking about the weather when he came in was an amusing moment.

[Lila_Q]

10 hours ago, H&Alover said:

Only light relief was the Tori/Christian/Jasmine story.  From what I saw it looked like Tori is Christian's boss - he was deferring to her when she was issuing her orders.   She, Tori, was really sniffy with Jasmine and Christian and she left Jasmine totally confused with her "be careful who you trust" talk.  Maybe he shouldn't have but I'm glad Justin blabbed, at least Jasmine wasn't left thinking Tori had changed her mind about the AVO and explained everything.  Jas' matchmaking didn't quite come off the way she planned right away.  Really chuckled when Tori burst through the doors at home ranting on and made the remark about the 'hot doc' only to find him sitting there.   Leah dragging Justin out to feed poor Buddy - who's' been abandoned in the garden again - so Christian and Tori could talk.  Hs admission that the only person he was interested was her was sweet and him saying he called her the 'hot doc' as he left made her day.  

Tori is not Christian's boss, she is Head of ED and he is neurosurgeon working at Neurology Department and he just comes to ED for consultations. Funny thing is that in real life Tori wouldn't be Jasmine's boss either, because in Australia nurses and doctors are managed by different managers, but H&A likes to present it 'old way' which makes my nurses friends angry.