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Dan F

1992 Episode Discussion

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It's just as well Pippa and Michael did try to stop David from seeing Sophie because now look at the damage he's done. This sickening "romance" caused her to get pregnant, and has ruined the rest of her life (whether or not the baby is taken away). Had they'd been stopped, Sophie wouldn't've gotten pregnant in the first place! see that's what I've been trying to say all along.

I take your point. In essence, they have been proved right in their attempt to keep Sophie and David apart, because they had (we assume) unprotected sex. However, I wrote the above from Sophie's point of view. To her, Pippa and Michael have done nothing but consistently let her down over the past year, so it's no wonder she ran away.

Well, you could argue the opposite point of view.Certainly, it's hard to see what good Pippa and Michael did by opposing the relationship because that's what they did and this is what happened as a result.If they'd accepted the relationship rather than effectively driving David out of town and contributing to the chain of events that led to his death, then Sophie's baby could have two parents and she wouldn't be facing up to life as a teenage and single mother and being scared of having the baby taken away because people think she can't cope.Taking it one step further, if Michael and Pippa hadn't been so determined to keep them apart, then their relationship may have progressed at a slower rate, rather than them possibly rushing into sleeping together out of a need to prove the reality of their feelings, and Sophie might not even be pregnant.Alternately, if David was still dead and Sophie was still pregnant but Michael and Pippa had supported her, then she wouldn't be left feeling that they don't care about her opinions and feelings and just want to force her to do what they think is best "for her own good" and she wouldn't have run away.

That said, I do think Sophie is being unduly paranoid.Michael and Pippa might not have a very good recent track record and both of them reacted badly to the news of her pregnancy but they both calmed down and proved supportive, so running away because of a worst case scenario that'd probably never happen does seem a bit extreme.

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It's just as well Pippa and Michael did try to stop David from seeing Sophie because now look at the damage he's done. This sickening "romance" caused her to get pregnant, and has ruined the rest of her life (whether or not the baby is taken away). Had they'd been stopped, Sophie wouldn't've gotten pregnant in the first place! see that's what I've been trying to say all along.

I take your point. In essence, they have been proved right in their attempt to keep Sophie and David apart, because they had (we assume) unprotected sex. However, I wrote the above from Sophie's point of view. To her, Pippa and Michael have done nothing but consistently let her down over the past year, so it's no wonder she ran away.

Well, you could argue the opposite point of view.Certainly, it's hard to see what good Pippa and Michael did by opposing the relationship because that's what they did and this is what happened as a result.If they'd accepted the relationship rather than effectively driving David out of town and contributing to the chain of events that led to his death, then Sophie's baby could have two parents and she wouldn't be facing up to life as a teenage and single mother and being scared of having the baby taken away because people think she can't cope.Taking it one step further, if Michael and Pippa hadn't been so determined to keep them apart, then their relationship may have progressed at a slower rate, rather than them possibly rushing into sleeping together out of a need to prove the reality of their feelings, and Sophie might not even be pregnant.Alternately, if David was still dead and Sophie was still pregnant but Michael and Pippa had supported her, then she wouldn't be left feeling that they don't care about her opinions and feelings and just want to force her to do what they think is best "for her own good" and she wouldn't have run away.

You could also argue if Tom hadn't lost his job in the city none of the characters would be in the situation they are now, but you have to reel it in at some point :) "What ifs" are not the same as "what actually happened", and the fact is that Pippa and especially Michael were worried about what Sophie and David would get up to. And essentially that's exactly what they did get up to. Anything else is conjecture so from looking at the facts alone Pippa and Michael were justified in their worries.

I do agree that if they had reacted differently to David and Sophie's relationship things may have developped differently and they may not even have slept together but that's a "what if" scenario. As you'll see from my bigger post above I'm no fan of the way Pippa and Michael have treated Sophie over the past year and I absolutely think they handled the David/Sophie situation wrongly, but the one aspect that I do agree with Old H&A Fan on is that their worries, if not their actions, were justified.

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I think that Old H&A Fan's reaction way over the top. I can understand the damage that Sophie is pregnant but to wish David's death... He might have even supported her and helped to raise a child if he hadn't died.

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I can't remember if Michael and Pippa were worried that Sophie and David might "do things" or not, they mostly seem to be complaining about the age gap.There is a grain of truth that she'd be more likely to go there with an older boyfriend but dating someone her own age is no guarantee that Things wouldn't Happen.As an aside, it's worth noting that despite her huge denial when she first found out, Sophie hasn't run away because she's pregnant per se but because she wants to keep the baby, which suggests she doesn't see the pregnancy as entirely negative.

Anyway, caught up on this week's episodes.One thing that Sophie's absence has done is that Sally and Fin, who up until now have been taking it in turns to hang out with her, are suddenly spending time together and building a decent sisterly relationship.Sally at SBH is a definite indication that "the early years" are over.And the happy news that Carly's had a baby daughter who will apparently be removed from continuity at some point over the next decade or so...

Like Meg, kind of up and down with Julie.She seemed pleasant at first, then we got a period in the middle of the week when she came across as controlling and smothering which I'm not sure Meg's leukaemia necessarily excuses, but then she seemed to show her vulnerable side with Alf and became a bit more empathetic towards Meg and I started to like her again.Have a feeling this might be how it's going to go from now on.

Bobby jumping to conclusions about Alf having an affair with Julie on zero evidence brings back bad memories of her doing the same about Pippa and Zac with as little justification.You'd think she'd learn...

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I think Roo was meant to be 16 when the show started, indicating a 1971 birthdate, but we had all those flashbacks to Bobby's conception where Alf definitely seemed to be married in 1970.But hey, continuity errors have been part of the show ever since "I'm your only niece, Aunt Celia", what with Sophie acting like her father brought her up when he was in jail or living with Bobby her entire life, most of Don's family appearing or disappearing as the plot demands and Martin's father changing his name between appearances.(And according to some people Steven abruptly changed school year at one point but I've never been entirely sure about that one.)

I suspect I'm in a minority of one here but I actually found myself on Frank's side by the end.Or at least I felt sorry for him.Okay, he behaved badly and people had good reason to dislike him but Greg's childish whining about wanting him to leave town got on my nerves, as did Don presumptuously assuming he was there to cause more trouble rather than because it's his home.Guess he did the noble thing in the end by getting out of Bobby and Greg's lives even though he didn't have anywhere else to go.I can just about get him being embraced like an old friend next time he turns up, although I recall Alf's still badmouthing him in a few months' time.(And I think Steven makes a comment around 1996 that suggests the family have lost touch with him.)

Talking of Alf, I still don't understand what Simon did to deserve Alf treating him like dirt.He was behaving as bad as Michael was about Blake when Crawford around, without the excuse of having someone dripping poison in his ear, yet somehow Michael's the one who always seems to get the abuse.Thank goodness he listened to Donald.

Sally's appearances have been few and far between this season, I'm wondering if it's got to the point where Kate Ritchie's schoolwork was limiting the amount of time she could be on set.It's a huge shame because she really does add something and having her flit in and out of the storyline means there's key stuff going on without her.I really wish we'd seen her reaction to Sophie's pregnancy rather than just having a few throwaway lines weeks after the fact.

And we never even saw Frank and Sally have any dialogue did we?

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I can't remember if Michael and Pippa were worried that Sophie and David might "do things" or not, they mostly seem to be complaining about the age gap.There is a grain of truth that she'd be more likely to go there with an older boyfriend but dating someone her own age is no guarantee that Things wouldn't Happen.As an aside, it's worth noting that despite her huge denial when she first found out, Sophie hasn't run away because she's pregnant per se but because she wants to keep the baby, which suggests she doesn't see the pregnancy as entirely negative.

Anyway, caught up on this week's episodes.One thing that Sophie's absence has done is that Sally and Fin, who up until now have been taking it in turns to hang out with her, are suddenly spending time together and building a decent sisterly relationship.Sally at SBH is a definite indication that "the early years" are over.And the happy news that Carly's had a baby daughter who will apparently be removed from continuity at some point over the next decade or so...

Like Meg, kind of up and down with Julie.She seemed pleasant at first, then we got a period in the middle of the week when she came across as controlling and smothering which I'm not sure Meg's leukaemia necessarily excuses, but then she seemed to show her vulnerable side with Alf and became a bit more empathetic towards Meg and I started to like her again.Have a feeling this might be how it's going to go from now on.

Bobby jumping to conclusions about Alf having an affair with Julie on zero evidence brings back bad memories of her doing the same about Pippa and Zac with as little justification.You'd think she'd learn...

IMO, I would more say Bobby's departure signals the end of The Early Years, but you know, each to his own.

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^For me it's a toss up between Carly getting married and Pippa getting a head transplant or Michael and Pippa getting married and Carly leaving for the end of the early years.But I may be influenced by the fact I started watching the show I 1992(in about 70 episodes' time)so once the likes of Greg, Fin, Damian and ultimately Shane and Angel start turning up, it definitely feels like a different era.

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^For me it's a toss up between Carly getting married and Pippa getting a head transplant or Michael and Pippa getting married and Carly leaving for the end of the early years.But I may be influenced by the fact I started watching the show I 1992(in about 70 episodes' time)so once the likes of Greg, Fin, Damian and ultimately Shane and Angel start turning up, it definitely feels like a different era.

No I agree with Captain Hulk the early years end for me when

Bobby is killed off. Sniff

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We had a thread about this last year/earlier this year and it ended up everyone had a slightly differing answer. We all had our opinions and perhaps decided by how much you subdivide the show. I tend to go for something around 600/end of 1990. I think the earliest was Tom's death, the latest Sally's 1st wedding.

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I see the end of the "black" opening credits as a good place to call the real Early Years quits. Though with the show still going in 2013, I would realistically say up to the late 90s is the early years, maybe Pippa's departure.

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