Zetti Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 I agree with this bit I just wish he'd let his children make their own mistakes. How else are they supposed to learn if daddy dearest is always trying to protect them If Jack and Lucas never realises their own mistakes then how can they move on and learn form them. Its impossible. You can protect your kids but there is a limit to how far you can go before you overstep the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaitieL Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 Exactly. I can understand wanting to protect them but it can only go so far. They have to live their own lives and learn from their own mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetti Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 True, if my parents protected me from everything then I would never have learnt anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Karen- Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 I apologise... I didn't feel I was jumping on anyone or trying to convert them. I was just debating the issues raised which I thought would be OK. I don't feel anyone is hurling abuse either... in fact, you have some very valid points and reasoned arguments. I know HotDad is not perfect and I have been critical about him myself (on occasions! ). I was disappointed he got involved in the Jack and Martha thing and I don't think he supported Lucas enough at times. I felt I was just expressing an opinion and I am definately not trying to stop people venting their feelings about him. There are characters I dislike that other people adore.... life would be boring if we all thought the same. You have a point about parents overprotecting their children... I guess you can understand why they do it but it's not neccesarily a good thing all the time. And sometimes it can destroy family relationships. Katie - What was it about him that you liked when he first arrived? I'm just curious as I didn't think he had changed much but you have got me thinking now.... maybe he has? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xGlowingAngelx Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 I find Tony's interference (sp?) and disapproval of Jack and Martha getting back together so soon quite laughable myself. What Jack went through with Sam was a horrible experience. She lied to him and went behind his back. It's understandable that Jack would feel secure with Martha. Yes, she's done some bad things, but nothing like that. And at least he's gone with someone who he does love and who loves him, which couldn't have been said when Tony jumped into bed with Naomi 5 minutes after Beth's death, despite the fact his son was pretty much in love with her aswell. Yes, I know they're better reasons FOR him to have the opinion, but shouldn't they also be the reasons he'd understand? At least they know and love each other. Anyway, that's all I wanted to say. I'll leave now because, despite that little rant, I don't dislike Tony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaitieL Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 Katie - What was it about him that you liked when he first arrived? I'm just curious as I didn't think he had changed much but you have got me thinking now.... maybe he has? I don't know how to explain it. He just seemed different when they first arrived. More fun, laid back and he seemed a hell of a lot supportive of his sons. They had a really good relationship and close bond and it seems to be have forgotten just little along the way. When was the last time him and Jack just went surfing? (besides when Lucas left and even that was a first in a very long time). He was a father and it's like the writers have tried to make him into to something else, some kind of chick magnet. Argh, I don't think I'm explaining myself that well, I only just woke up. I know what I'm trying to say, but can't seem to find the right words. I think it was after Beth's death that he's really changed, and I can understand that it would. But he's completely flipped over. I lost all respect for him after the Naomi thing. The Tony I knew and loved when he first arrived would never have done that. I think the whole engagement with Rachel has something to do with it as well. I think he's just rushing it a little. I don't like the feel of the relationship but I do believe that he loves Rachel. I'm just don't think they're marrying each other for the right reasons. I think that he's lonely and I think that Tony believes he needs to be in a stable relationship. He regrets that he didn't propose to Beth sooner and he probably thinks that if they'd gotten married then she wouldn't have left, and then died. I think he's trying to hold on just a little. And well Rachel, I think she's just desperate to have children and sees Tony as the answer to her children problems. Even though that's one important issue that they haven't yet discussed. It could go both ways, but I do think that Tony wouldn't mind have another child. And then there's the fact that I don't think her and Kim are yet divorced and I don't think she's fully dealt with that marriage break down. I know her and Tony have been friends for a couple of years and many Tachel fans believe that it's the base for a solid marriage, but been friends doesn't necessarily mean that it's going to make a marriage work. Oh my lordy, look at that. I didn't mean to ramble. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Karen- Posted April 30, 2008 Report Share Posted April 30, 2008 Don't worry I can ramble with the best of them! I guess he was a lot closer to his sons in the beginning, they were a very 'tight' group I seem to remember. Cooking as a family, not lying to each other, etc. But I guess other people kind of got in the way of their closeness which was inevitable, i.e. Beth, Martha and Matilda. The scenes with just the three of them were few and far between after that which has been a little disapppointing. As for being a chick magnet .... Although I didn't agree with the Naomi thing, as it was out of character, it was a good storyline to watch and I understand that they did it to show his grief and despair. It was going after the other random women that irked me a little. I thought he has learned his lesson after Naomi but obviously he didn't. I loved his relationship with Jazz and I felt it only helped his character and gave him more depth. Although I have been a Tachel supporter from the beginning (and long before) I think the engagement is rushed, you have no argument from me on that. But I think again it is out of character and I can't help but think they (the writers) have rushed it for a reason. Like they did with Jack and Martha so that Zoe could blow up the barn! The children issue is something that is beginning to irritate me, I hope it is raised soon. Then at least we will have more idea about their thoughts on it. At the moment we are a little 'in the dark' about it. I guess he has changed over time.... but I don't think it's for the worse, it's just different Since Lucas left there does seem to be an element missing from his life which has the potential to make his character a bit one dimensional. You could say that Rachel has given him a different element though. I am just hoping they have some good stuff up their sleeve for him in the coming months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterHolden Posted May 1, 2008 Report Share Posted May 1, 2008 If only this thread had been around when Lucas was here lol. I don't hate Tony at all, but I did hate the way he treated Lucas a lot of the time. Right now I just think he's an idiot for choosing Rachel over Jazz and I don't know how much sympathy I'll have for him when Rachel inevitably destroys him like she destroyed Kim. It annoys me that I can't get Tony scenes now without having to see her , but he does still have some nice moments with Jazz, like last night He has been a bit boring lately, but Tony's never been an action-packed character. He's more suited to the fatherly role (even if he SUX at being Lucas' father!) but now that both his own kids have abandoned him (Luc physically, Jack emotionally) and all the Hunters are long gone (when's the last time he actually spoke to Mattie?) he's stuck being the poor fool who somehow thinks that Rachel is going to do something other than chew him up, maybe get a kid out of him, and then spit him out again with the demand that he have nothing to do with HER child. I can see it all now Still, I don't think any of that warrants a hate thread for Tony. He's just... not doing much, that's all. If this thread WAS aroound when Lucas was around, then I would've thrown more abuse at him than anything. The only reason why I dislike him is because he kept sleeping with random girls nearly every week (without fail) through getting drunk. Not to mention the fact that he was being a hypocrit towards Jack and Martha's relationship near the end of 2007/Early 2008. I was glad Jack told him to mind his own business. It's about time Jack stood up against his dad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaitieL Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 Oh by the way karena, I didn't think you were trying to convert me. I think it will take me a bit before I do go back to loving Tony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zetti Posted May 2, 2008 Report Share Posted May 2, 2008 I don't feel anyone is hurling abuse either... in fact, you have some very valid points and reasoned arguments. Thats good. I dont hate him really really badly. He just kind of gets on my nerves at the moment. I do love his relationship with Rachel though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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